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ConsumerFi Podcast: The Future of Remote Working with People Strategies’ Terri Horn

July 22, 2021

Episode 34


Joel is joined by Terri Horn of People Strategies to discuss how the recent remote work trend during COVID has changed how we do business moving forward, including how managers may need to adapt to employee preferences to keep top talent, how working from home frees employees from traditional 9-5 working hours constraints, and the unique challenges remote interviews present in the hiring process.

You can meet Joel in person at the National Automotive Finance Association’s 25th Annual Non-Prime Auto Financing Conference this August 30 – September 1, 2021 in Plano, Texas. Register today!

ConsumerFi is presented by Nortridge Software: Loan Software That Accelerates Change.

And special thanks to The National Automotive Finance Association: The only trade association exclusively serving the nonprime auto finance industry.


[0 4:29:22 AM] Joel Kennedy: [0 4:29:22 AM] You’re listening to the ConsumerFi podcast powered by Nortridge loan software that accelerates dream.

[00:00:20] Everybody welcome. Good for the ConsumerFi podcast, we have Terry Horn who is with People Strategies and for folks who, who don’t know Terry, uh, but I doubt anybody in. Non-prime auto doesn’t know who you are. Terry. We’re really fortunate to have you within the ecosystem because Terry is an expert on people and the whole HR piece and attracting talent and retaining talent and rewarding talent and all that talent stuff is really important.

[00:00:47] So, Terry, thank you so much for joining today.

[00:00:49] Terri Horn: [00:00:49] So thank you so much for asking me to be part of one of your podcasts. I’m I’m very.

[00:00:56] Joel Kennedy: [00:00:56] Outstanding. Well, Terri you’re, you’re a local San Diego. How, how have you found [00:01:00] the, um, the pandemic to be with life and everything? How have you been how’s business? How’s it.

[00:01:06] Terri Horn: [00:01:06] Well, I didn’t learn how to play tennis like you did, but, um, I did, uh, I did do a lot of hiking and just trying to, you know, get outdoors, California is great for, for that in, um, you know, we’ve got such fantastic weather, so, uh, swimming, you know, hiking and just, you know, spending a lot of quality time with my Mo with my family.

[00:01:26] I didn’t love my husband working from home so much, but he’s back in the office now. So, uh, that that’s all good. Um, but you know, we had a lot of great things. Enters and, uh, playing board games, which, you know, we generally reserve that for vacations when there’s no TV. And I would say I’m pretty much caught up on my Netflix at this point.

[00:01:46] It was, it was a tough year for people’s strategies. We, um, you know, everybody stopped and it was kind of in a hold pattern and which meant, you know, the domino effect is my business is in a whole pattern. So I’m glad to be, you know, [00:02:00] hitting it 110% trying to keep up the pace. You know, I went from.

[00:02:03] Changing from my day pajamas to my night pajamas. So, you know, I’m, I’m really, you know, trying to stay schedule and stay on task and just, you know, get results for my clients right now. And it’s just been great. It’s, it’s wonderful to have these conversations and, and, and talk to people again and, and, you know, see what they’re going through, what their pain points are, what their wins are, you know, what obstacles they’re facing.

[00:02:26] And so now here we are today talking about, you know, getting, getting

[00:02:31] Joel Kennedy: [00:02:31] tired. Yeah. And, and I would assume, I mean, I, it seems, I just, I kind of monitor LinkedIn and some other places to see how many posts do I see about somebody switching a job or posting an open position. It looks like a pretty healthy market right now.

[00:02:45] It looks like things have kind of opened up from the ice age that we were experiencing in the spring and summer of last year. Have you seen the same thing? Are you, are you getting more calls? Are you hearing more people wanting to. To move or to maybe get, you know, need your [00:03:00] professional guidance in terms of placing

[00:03:02] Terri Horn: [00:03:02] well, you know, despite the inventory problem that I think, you know, everyone’s being impacted by right now, I’m still seeing a lot of interest in revenue generating positions.

[00:03:13] So a lot of, a lot of business development, a lot of sales, a lot of account management positions are coming to the forefront. You know, I generally don’t post all the positions that I have available, but I do, you know, do a lot of shout outs for a territory. Sales reps. So that’s probably some of the stuff you see on my LinkedIn, but for sure the optimism is there to, you know, grow and to move forward.

[00:03:36] And so for me, that’s always a very, very positive,

[00:03:40] Joel Kennedy: [00:03:40] you know, Northridge who I worked for and it was a proud sponsor of the podcast. Thank you. Loan management software company based out of lake forest, orange county, very beautiful neighborhood up there. Matter of fact, I was just there on Monday. I did notice, you know, in the office it was, it was like, it was a little different than what I would expect having a full force back at work.

[00:03:58] Now we’re a technology [00:04:00] company. Okay. So we do have developers and people with very relevant, specific skill sets. That are working, you know, pretty much remote all the time. So my lens, my personal lens is, is, is very unique. So let’s talk about folks that are more analogous to the, you know, relevant to the listeners.

[00:04:19] People that have large scale credit, ops loan, origination, loan, servicing, all the tangential things, dealing with vendors, having to train people, keep people coming through. How have you kept tabs with those folks who run those organizations? And how are they managing through the transition back from work

[00:04:38] Terri Horn: [00:04:38] from home?

[00:04:39] I have been in constant contact with, with several people, you know, throughout the process or throughout the pandemic, you know, from kind of the early stages of it asking, you know, for benchmarking information. And then, you know, through the course of the. You know, 15, 16 months it’s been for us out here in California, but you know, every, every state’s being impacted by it, [00:05:00] even, you know, our friends in Canada are, you know, still dealing with a lot of, uh, issues as it relates to, you know, workforce engagement and you know, how they, you know, are keeping their productivity going.

[00:05:11] And I will give a huge shout out to the technology team. Throughout the country in every industry, not just ours, you know, they should be getting the time award of the year because of what they were able to do in such a short time. I mean, seamless transitions in most cases, to get people working from home that, you know, didn’t have the technology or the laptops or, you know, the equipment.

[00:05:34] And then all of a sudden, you know, within a, uh, you know, a months period of time for many collections departments and customer service people. Obviously challenges to manage a remote team when you’ve gone from face-to-face to all of a sudden remote, but most of my clients will tell you that they, you know, really didn’t skip much of a beat during this process and that their productivity was good.

[00:05:57] You know, obviously expenses were down. [00:06:00] Um, but you know, they were able to, to handle it. I will say though, I think there’s a exhaustion point that people have hit, you know, it’s really hard for management to continue to manage in, in the. Type of environment and, you know, there has been a call to come back to work.

[00:06:16] And so, you know, dealing with that, I think has probably been, you know, this is all unknown, right? We’re all in unchartered territory. But I think they are hopeful that people will want to come back to work. And I think there’s going to be isolated situations where people, either one have auto-immune issues and you know, aren’t comfortable going back to work.

[00:06:37] You have family members that might be impacted. I know I’ve heard a lot in the reading and the news and such that there are people still a little hesitant to jump right back in. You know, they’d like to see the vaccination levels increase more before they go back. But then there are other people that couldn’t wait.

[00:06:54] You know, back in the office and get back to some semblance of normalcy for them.

[00:06:59] Joel Kennedy: [00:06:59] It seems to me like you [00:07:00] really just, you’re going to have some pain, whether you continue working from home, you work in a hybrid, or you go back into the office. I think of all these scenarios. So I think of my situation, right?

[00:07:09] So I have two kids, God bless San Diego county for this grant. They got, they get free summer school. So they’re at summer school and then they have like an afterschool enrichment program. So they get dropped off at 7, 7 15, and then I don’t have to go get them until three. If I was working at an office and I was leaving to get them, I’d have to probably leave at like three every day.

[00:07:28] Right. So optics around that used to be used to be with all of the, uh, kind of, oh, I’ll call them the old school. I need to see everybody. If I can’t see you’re you’re, you’re goofing off kind of thing. I think we’ve, I think we’ve blown that idea away it’s gone, but let’s really focus on the stress. So you have the stress now.

[00:07:47] If I’m working from home, am I going to be at a disadvantage to the people that are working hybrid or backend? You mentioned the stress that the managers are feeling. Can you imagine, as a manager, you had your process, you know, I’m thinking of somebody like a shout out to Doug brown. Doug brown is Mr.

[00:08:00] [00:07:59] Process guys, very military and is we have this morning meeting every Tuesday at 9:00 AM and everybody’s there. And then we do this and then blah, blah, blah. Right. So I think about the stress that that would throw on somebody like that. Doug. We’d love you by the way. Great local, local, uh, uh, servicing expert, uh, consumer lending, anything banking expert.

[00:08:17] Doug’s the best. Anyway, so there are stresses, right? You got to pick your poison, whether you’re going to work hybrid home or at the office, what are you, what are you hearing from folks about those various? You mentioned the one with the managers, but, but is that something that. I would think people have to concern themselves with that if they want to kind of manage

[00:08:33] Terri Horn: [00:08:33] through this.

[00:08:34] Yeah. And kudos to you for just bringing up the working dad element. I think a lot of people think that, you know, it’s only the moms that are affected when in fact, you know, a lot of dads are, you know, impacted my, my kids are older and they both drive. So there’s a lot. You know, stress on me than there was when I had kids your age, but I’m really glad to hear you bring that up because you know, millions of women quit the workforce last year.

[00:08:57] Not because they had to, not because of [00:09:00] their job performance or anything to do with their job, but they couldn’t juggle the teacher. You know, homeschooling and, you know, managing the children’s education along with the pressures of a full-time job. So, so thank you for bringing that up and, and I’m just going to give you an example because I have a couple of them right now that are kind of running ahead, not head to head, but you know, alongside one other, I have a FinTech company that is mostly, truly FinTech in that they are a disruptor and new to the auto space.

[00:09:29] And then I have a FinTech company that has an. slate of seasoned autofinance people that are getting into technology. The first FinTech company, they’re fine with everyone working remote from their loan officers to, you know, their executives. I don’t think the COO has been in his office in 15 months.

[00:09:49] That’s just, you know how it’s gone for him. However, the latter one, you know, they’re hiring and they want people. In the office. So for me, I kind of look at it as it’s a, it’s a [00:10:00] management style approach. Right? So if some management is able to handle the remote aspects of continuing along this way, until it makes sense for them.

[00:10:11] To, you know, converge back on the office then. Okay. But then I have another, you know, completely different mindset of, of people that say, Hey, you know, I like being able to walk down the hall and just pop in on, on Bob or Joe or Mary and say, you know, what do you think about this idea? And so, you know, it, it, while we were inconvenienced by this pandemic pushing a new way of work on us, I do believe that.

[00:10:35] Not going away, you know, I think it’s going to be here to stay. And so it’s really a matter of people getting their arms wrapped around that and hoping that they can individualize the needs of their star players or else they may see those folks not stick around. And I have one case where an auto finance company exact called me and said, you know, I have this specialized collector and [00:11:00] she, you know, we want them all to come in the office.

[00:11:01] And she called and said that. Going to quit. He goes, I really need her. And I said, well, can’t you give her another three months? He was like, well, yeah, sure. Well then give her another three months. Right? I mean, it’s, everybody’s kind of managing through this process, you know, individually. And I think, you know, while we like to try to, you know, bring as much consistency to our processes as we can, this pandemic has really kind of thrown that all up in the air.

[00:11:26] And so. The best managers are going to be the ones that can remain flexible, remain nimble and, you know, just being in touch and in tune with what their employees need.

[00:11:37] Joel Kennedy: [00:11:37] What do you think, or what do you think employee? I know this is a tough question. Yes. But it’s like the kind of, what do employees want?

[00:11:43] What do you think from the, from the employee side? I mean, so I hear a little bit of everything. I got people that want to come back. Have to stay home. Cause they, I mean, look, there’s a relevant piece here. That’s it’s still not solved. And I don’t think we’re going to get through it until it’s solved, which is vaccination rates, [00:12:00] particularly for the younger population and until the fall, when they go back to school.

[00:12:04] Right? So those are two elements that I say can kind of hamstring us in our efforts. What do you think from the, the voice of the employee? What are you hearing from folks that, that are on that side of the.

[00:12:13] Terri Horn: [00:12:13] I hear a lot of requests for, you know, remote or hybrid opportunities. And I hear a lot of questions about expectations for, or requests for some type of flex work arrangement.

[00:12:27] And you brought up a really fantastic situation where, you know, you have. Childcare until three 30 every day. And so, you know, even if you’re doing some type of hybrid working, you know, in sections of your day, although I’m seeing every people, everyone that’s reporting that they’re working remotely, they’re giving way more hours because they’re working into the evening.

[00:12:49] They’re working earlier in the morning. For from home for 15 years. So I, you know, I’ve built some disciplines into my day, but I also do have a great deal of flexibility. And I [00:13:00] think that having that traditional eight to five schedule is pretty much lost on remote workers. And I think as long as managers understand that, you know, and the productivity level there versus the FaceTime, I think we just need to learn what we’re measuring and how to reward for it.

[00:13:16] There’s nothing

[00:13:17] Joel Kennedy: [00:13:17] that kills me more. I have to. And have you worked in a situation where you got some other office and there’s somebody that says you got to come out here for this thing. So you fly out and they sit around and JobOne all day long with people. And you’re like, bro, you know, you’re coming in the office.

[00:13:32] I don’t care how many hours you’re here, but you’re not working. Okay. We could have done a zoom call and I never would have had to step in. We would have saved money on the flight and you can sit there and just, you know, Naval exam all day long. I mean, I don’t need that. I’m hoping that we’re forever changed in that respect.

[00:13:47] We now have better confidence in these tools. Think about some of the folks look I’m about there. I’m about to hit the point where I’m going to be an old dog and it can be hard to teach me some new tech stuff, but I did, I had to muscle [00:14:00] up and figure out podcasting and also their technology stuff, but there are going to be people who are a little older.

[00:14:06] May not be as technically conversant. You know, I think the whole zoom thing was probably a little bit of a challenge for them. Just figuring out I can’t get my camera to work. Where do I, where do I view all this stuff? You know, in my mind, it’s like, look, you’re either going to get yourself to the point where you can figure this stuff out or you get your daughter or son to help you kind of get through it.

[00:14:25] And if not, then you’re probably going to have to go into the office. Cause that’s going to dictate that, you know, this kind of setup isn’t really working for you and you might need a little bit more. And that could be good for you ultimately, but there’s so many factors built in here with this whole transition.

[00:14:39] It’s just, we’re, we’re probably going to have some hybrid configuration from now on, I mean, look it, they held court cases on zoom.

[00:14:48] Terri Horn: [00:14:48] Right successfully. I might add very successfully. They, you know, they were able to do that. And I know the California court system came back on July 1st and, you know, people are scrambling to make that kind of [00:15:00] change over or offer an option.

[00:15:02] And matter of fact, I know people in the legal arena and they were saying they are continued to be offered the option of showing up in person or doing it via a video.

[00:15:11] Joel Kennedy: [00:15:11] So that’s fantastic. From my standpoint, let’s say I sign it. I sign a nondisclosure agreement or an agreement with somebody and we have a dispute, but I’m in California, but they say they they’re the ones they had hand in the transaction.

[00:15:22] So they said we’re our, our venue is Dallas, Texas. A talent is it’s a state of Texas. I don’t have to fly out there. Now I can do it. It’s a lot less onerous on me. And then I’d be more willing to accept that as the venue, because I understand why you select a Texas you’re there and you liked the, you like the way that they’re laid up.

[00:15:39] Terry there’s, there’s so much in the topic. There’s so much back and forth. And, and I do another thing that you said really resonated with me as I have also worked from home for, for, for a great deal of time. And I’ve been very vocal about. That I think, you know, for certain people like you and me, it makes a lot of sense.

[00:15:56] I understand that it is a privilege and I treat [00:16:00] it as such. Right. That’s why ever since I can remember, I have never declined a meeting because it was too early in the morning to late in the day. Maybe if I have conflict, but too early, I’ll meet you wherever you are. I’ll be on the call. 5:00 AM and I’ve done it.

[00:16:17] People who know and work with me, I’ve done it all the time. So I have certain things that I throw into the mix. Right. I am. I am going to remove all these inconvenient. I’m not going to call these things inconveniences any longer than other people would deem as such, because otherwise you get, okay. Well, you know, my, my office hours are eight to five, but I have meetings because I’m in the office and everybody wants a piece of it.

[00:16:38] I have meetings for about six of those hours. So basically a 45 minutes, you know, that, that you can kind of mess with, versus me saying, I don’t have a commute. I don’t have a hard stop. I can put things on my calendar when and wherever I want. I love the whole work from home thing. You know, I, I hope that we’re going to still be able to.

[00:16:54] To deal with that as we, as we kind of move forward. Let’s, let’s talk a little bit about some of the, some [00:17:00] of the regulatory needs you met. You mentioned that we were kind of talking before, you know, I think about an, an obviously neither of us are our compliance or legal experts, but I think about some of the requirements around personal identifiable information or other kind of compliance things where it’s like, Hey, I might be working from home.

[00:17:20] We used to think, look, you had to be in the office where the license was hanging on the wall and none of the data can kind of like walk out of those confines guys. It’s superficial. We’ve been doing cloud computing for a while. The data is out there in the ether. If your agent is attaching to it, you put some controls within their environment.

[00:17:37] Uh, you should be fine. What are some of the things that you think? Cause I don’t even know, like were, were collectors even allowed to collect from home in certain states? I don’t even know. I

[00:17:45] Terri Horn: [00:17:45] don’t know the answer to that either. I’m I am no, by no means, uh, you know, any type of general counsel here on that aspect.

[00:17:53] But my understanding is that through the VPNs and the servers and, and the [00:18:00] IDs. People need to sign in and sign out. They probably have just as much information from the routers that, you know, the, the data shows. I mean, I’ve talked to people that say, they know when people are hanging up on calls or they know.

[00:18:17] When, you know, a call should average, you know, a certain amount of time and someone’s either on too long or too, too short, you know, they’re able to determine if there’s some kind of, you know, misalignment, if you will, um, with that. And so, you know, allows a manager to do a deeper dive in some research to find out what’s what’s really going on for a remote call, but in terms of regulatory, I would just venture to say that.

[00:18:43] I think everyone did the best that they could to make sure that information was not accessible outside of their normal purview of work, whether they were sitting there in the actual call center or sitting at home, [00:19:00] accessing the data during their Workday. I mean, I’m

[00:19:03] Joel Kennedy: [00:19:03] just super pleased to see that look, the larger organizations had already had a lot of this infrastructure built in, you know, capital, one of the world.

[00:19:09] For example, obviously can deal with remote work. But then you came to the smaller financial services companies that didn’t have the time or the financial wherewithal to build out this infrastructure they were forced to do so. And so now you have that infrastructure in place. And then, then you start thinking about how you’ve extended this to your employees.

[00:19:25] How do I extend this to my customers to make it super easy for them to engage with me in all these ways? And that’s where I’ve seen a lot of movement that I’m very happy with. So I’ll tell you a story. I won’t, I won’t give you the source, but I’ll give you the, the, the basis. So picture this Terri you’re, I’m hiring for a position I’m interviewing an individual, I’m doing it all on zoom.

[00:19:47] Everything seems to be, to be straight up, I’m ready to hire, but I re I really want to see the individual to make sure that they are it’s, I’m actually who I’m dealing with. Right. You’re going to be a permanently [00:20:00] remote employee only to kind of figure out that, through that exercise that they were. Not really the knowledgeable person that they said they were, they were kind of a front and there’s somebody behind them that is feeding them all the answers and that has the skillset to get through the interview.

[00:20:23] So you’re not hiring think you’re hiring right. Begs a lot of questions. Right. So you think about the things that we deal with when you’re hiring. And how do I hire somebody without actually interacting with them at all? Or seeing that they’re an actual person they’re positively representing themselves without running into some hiring, uh, eco type stuff.

[00:20:47] Right? Yep. I just want to see and make sure you’re real. I don’t care what you look like. I don’t care if you look like this and sound like this or whatever. That was an interesting one that I heard about a week [00:21:00] or two ago that. Well, this one could kind of disrupt things a little bit. This, this, this could host.

[00:21:06] I doubt it’s I doubt it’s frequent, but anyway,

[00:21:10] Terri Horn: [00:21:10] well, I mean, catfishing is a, I mean, they made a show about it. So whether you’re being ghosted or catfish in life or in a job interview, or, you know, I mean, it’s, it’s a reality it’s and it’s something you do have to face. And, and as a former risk executive, as I know you to be, you know, you’ve got to look at those, those elements and make sure that you’re not being.

[00:21:32] Uh, misled in any way. And I think for me having multiple conversations with a potential candidate or someone that I’m looking to represent to my client, I think it’s really crucial to have multiple conversations with. And, you know, your story brings up a story that I have, which is I had a young gentleman, probably in his early twenties, come in with a beautiful resume.

[00:21:57] I mean, that’s why I brought him in. Everything was great. I [00:22:00] started asking him questions. He didn’t really know the answers. He finally broke down and said, well, my mom wrote it. And I said, well, maybe you need to send your mom and for the interview because we’re, you know, it was, it was just a, it was a blatant misrepresentation, and, you know, gosh, I want to help my kids too, but I also don’t want them to fail, you know, fall flat on their face the first day on their job.

[00:22:18] So yeah, it is unfortunate. There’s always going to be things like that out there. And I would only say that, you know, multiple and frequent conversations. And, you know, zoom can only get you so much or, or a video call can only get you so much. So additional calls, if you can offer a face to face. I know in the last six months as my business started to pick up again, most of my clients required that final interview to be a face-to-face.

[00:22:47] So you can’t forget the, the element of it. Building a rapport, right? I mean, there’s only you and I for coffee, we see each other at conferences, you know, we live in the same town. So, you know, we have a [00:23:00] rapport, but you know, when you’re meeting someone for the first time or even meeting through them through an extension of a referral, you just need to build that rapport with that person.

[00:23:08] So not only are you assessing for skillset, but you’re assessing for chemistry. I mean, you know, the competence thing is, is obviously the first and foremost piece, but the chemistry of them working. With your team with you, with other people, you know, in your organization, that is as important. Once you get through the competency factors, finding those ways to assess the chemistry is crucial before you make that hiring decision.

[00:23:35] And I know you’ve heard this and probably said it yourself. As it takes a few minutes to make a hiring decision, it takes a little, it takes a lot longer to find an exit

[00:23:45] Joel Kennedy: [00:23:45] strategy. Oh, yeah, that’s for sure. I remember, uh, you know, an old buddy of mine, it’s, it’s a slightly pessimistic point of view, but he said, uh, when you interview somebody, that’s, that’s the best you’re going to see him.

[00:23:57] It’s always downhill from there. I don’t believe I don’t subscribe [00:24:00] to that, but, but it was kind of funny, you know, you hear it you’re oh, you can do that. You know? Oh, great. Super hype on him and then me and then, and then on day one, they say, ah, the real person shows up. You don’t have your mom there. Mom, your mom can’t come.

[00:24:14] So. Well, let’s, let’s finish on this one. Cause I think this is probably one that folks really have a question about. You’re going to deal with a hybrid situation. You’ve got people in the office. Obviously I can pull certain leavers to, to keep them happy. How about for remote employees? Have you heard anything about how to keep them motivated and happy?

[00:24:35] Terri Horn: [00:24:35] Yeah. So, uh, again, being, uh, having researched this quite a bit of late, because I’m, you know, being asked of this by managers and, you know, I’m sensing their frustration of, you know, why doesn’t everybody just want to come back to work. And again, for the reasons I highlighted earlier, you know, some people are just.

[00:24:53] And the mental space to get back to work and so, or capable because of childcare issues, you know, [00:25:00] health issues, um, you know, a variety of different things. So I think the most important thing to do is listen to what they’re asking you for offering them choices. I’ve seen everything from survey monkey.

[00:25:12] Sir, uh, surveys going out to employees asking them, you know, five key questions around, you know, w do you know, do they want to continue to work from home? Would they like to come back into the office? Do they see themselves returning back to the office? You know, offering them some flexibility? I think, you know, listening and offering flexibility is, is going to be key and managing the continued remote workforce.

[00:25:35] The remote workers are also seeing that it’s not always. Beneficial or it’s a, it’s a kind of survival mode right now. It’s that kind of, you know, hierarchy of needs of, you know, I’m just trying to get through right now until I can get my kids back on a normal schedule or I can get my life back on a normal schedule.

[00:25:53] You know, there are so many intrinsic benefits benefits of being in the office, you know, you’re, you see [00:26:00] more, you know, more what’s going on. You know, you have exposure time to people that you wouldn’t normally get. So there’s, there’s lots of benefits to going back in the office. And I read some thing out of Forbes saying that even though remote workers are working more and they’re working later into the evening, they’re not receiving the bonuses that they used to receive, which I think is a big piece of, you know, your incentive.

[00:26:23] I know the Biden administration saying you got to pay people more. And while I certainly believe there’s an element of that in many states across our country. I do think that, you know, it’s not just about the pay right now, and I think you have to find out what is driving, what is motivating or what are the issues for, for each of the employees on an individual basis?

[00:26:43] We can’t, can’t just paint everybody with the same brush.

[00:26:46] Joel Kennedy: [00:26:46] No, you can’t. I mean, I, you know, obviously for you and me being flexible, One of our top criteria for being happy within a certain position or role, it’s something that I’ve been accustomed to dealing with. And it’s just something that I’ve always felt entitled [00:27:00] to and entitled to a, you know, to the employees.

[00:27:03] You know, I think about somebody who’s a single parent and you’ve got a kid who’s a home sick. Can I please just work from home? I was always inclined to say, Where I ran into problems was when some of the regulations hit. Right. So then, okay, well you’re doing this for this one person 90 to have a policy that clearly states these are the criteria and all that.

[00:27:20] So yeah, you do have to kind of be covered. My hope is that people across the board appreciate having an appreciation or the challenges that exist. And obviously, look, we’ve had, we’ve gone through a lot. Right? And there’s even been a lot of social changes. There are different mandates within different states for your people that have to take certain sensitivity training.

[00:27:39] That’s that’s now mandated that wasn’t before. Correct. And so as we get back into the office, I think, you know, I’ve been noticing for me, people are really coming out of the woods. And asking me to just do fun stuff, activities, meet back up for coffee, this and that. And I’ve, I’ve had to say no in the past week because of one it’s too much.

[00:27:58] And then number two, the other thing that [00:28:00] I worry, I wonder about, and I’d love to have you back on maybe down the road to talk about this is let’s fast forward, about six months, maybe a year, and we’ve gotten back into the office. We just spent over a year working remote home alone. And being able to control how and when I’m interacting with people, if I don’t want to answer my phone, I don’t answer my phone, but if I’m sitting on the floor and you want to talk to me and you’re my manager, okay.

[00:28:26] Now I’m going to be walking around a little bit more stressed, just naturally stressed about, I don’t know what’s going to happen today, or maybe I was home. Like to watch certain comedies that is fine for watching comedy, but it’s not appropriate for work. And I bring these jokes into the workplace right now.

[00:28:43] It’s all of a sudden, you know, that was, you know, probably not acceptable for, it’s definitely not acceptable now. And people are more motivated to say, that’s not cool. I’m calling you out. I’m going to be anti discriminatory, biased, racist, [00:29:00] whatever. And then now you need to manage all of that. Within the office as well.

[00:29:06] And I think that’s something that I don’t know what you think, Terry, do you think, that’s you think that we have think we have the capability as, as, as humans to be able to manage through that effectively, or I think I personally think we’re going to need some help. I think we’re gonna need some tools.

[00:29:20] Oh, I

[00:29:20] Terri Horn: [00:29:20] definitely think we need tools. And, uh, you know, and I do think it comes to just stepping back and having a greater understanding and appreciation for other people’s differences. And I think, you know, despite your background and where you’re coming from and what was learned behavior from your families or, or whatever, and what you consider funny versus what someone else considers humorous, you know, it’s all about being respectful and.

[00:29:46] Being understanding that, you know, somebody else might walk in a different pair of shoes than you do. And then if you can keep that in mind as you’re navigating this new world, because a lot has changed. And just to point back on that regulatory issue [00:30:00] is the benefit of the regulators is they all had to work from home too.

[00:30:04] So they learned how to. Uh, handle things probably very differently than what they would have done. Had they been able to go to the office or do their field visits and, and a variety of, of things. So I think that it’s changing everyone’s mind. And I think that when you go through these type of paradigm shifts, it’s going to be uncomfortable.

[00:30:23] You know, it’s going to be awkward for a while and I would love six months from now. Talk about, you know, as well as I can’t wait to read the history books about what happened, you know, in 2020 when we had this pandemic and what they thought of

[00:30:37] Joel Kennedy: [00:30:37] it. Yeah. You’re, you’re respected, you know, a great deal about this.

[00:30:41] You’re such a great resource to the industry. I need to thank you for that for folks that maybe want to pick your brain a little bit, or maybe they need to play some people. Can you tell a little bit about your business and some ways for people to get ahold of you?

[00:30:55] Terri Horn: [00:30:55] The easiest way to get ahold of me is via LinkedIn, but my background, as you know, [00:31:00] and a big, another shout out to Doug brown, but I started in this industry making and collecting loans for beneficial.

[00:31:06] State New York. And I morphed over into other aspects of consumer lending and finally landed at household auto finance, which became HSBC auto. I left there and had a short stint in retail as a, uh, executive for their store operations. And then, you know, my kids were little three and five. Uh, you know, I just couldn’t travel the way that I had been traveling and, you know, to be gone three and four days a week was too much.

[00:31:33] So I started people’s strategies using my human resources, skills, and background and experience. And because I had over a hundred friends from my, my HSBC days that were all, you know, scattered around, you know, for 15 years later, you know, my children are grown and driving and almost off to college. And one of them.

[00:31:53] Here I am handling mostly recruitment, but I do consult with managers and executives on [00:32:00] key issues that face their business or their leadership team, and happy to speak with anyone as it relates to that, I will be going to the NAF conference. I just signed up yesterday. We have to hear that. And then, you know, my plan is to hit Absa later in October and.

[00:32:17] I’ll be able to squeeze in the auto finance summit toward the end of the week. It’ll be a busy week, but I’m excited because while I do work from home and I am very disciplined, I do draw my energy from others. And it’s always such a fun time to go in and talk with others and exchange ideas and just catch up if there’s anything I can ever do for you.

[00:32:37] You know, you know where I am, Joel,

[00:32:40] Joel Kennedy: [00:32:40] and for folks that don’t know where you are, You want to give a phone? Or I know you said, you said LinkedIn, but phone, email website. Okay. So

[00:32:47] Terri Horn: [00:32:47] it’s Terry dot horn at search pro. Dot com my phone number is (619) 749-9656. It’s probably better to email me, but you know, I’m [00:33:00] happy to chat with anyone in this industry that is looking for a sounding board

[00:33:05] Joel Kennedy: [00:33:05] or a thought partner.

[00:33:06] Well, you you’re, like I said, great partner, great supporter to the industry. They’re very knowledgeable. Has the chops to know when people are looking for a role intimately about how that kind of fits into. Into the overall mix. She is the head of people strategies. Terry, thank you so much for joining us today.

[00:33:24] Thanks Joel. The consumer five podcast has been brought to you by Northbridge loan software. That accelerates change. We’d also like to thank the national automotive finance association, the only trade association, exclusively serving the non-prime auto financing industry.

[00:33:47] Um, [00:34:00]

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